I just built my first TrueNAS server. I went through what I imagined to be fairly rigorous testing of my intended HDDs (four 10Tb HGST drives) before installing TrueNAS. As the hardware platform consists of my older (2012) Gigabyte mobo and same-aged Intel i7 CPU, 16Gb DDR3 RAM, on-board graphics, I was able to subject the HDDs to lengthy testing using Seagate SeaTools and the Disks utility under Ubuntu. All four were reported as “PASSED” w no problems evident to me. So, I pulled the Ubuntu SSD and installed TrueNAS Core on two mirrored 120Gb SSDs. Problems were immediately evident on TWO (2) of the FOUR (4) HGST HDDs, both of which have been returned under separate RMAs for replacement. Both HDDs had problems that I suspect should have been prominently flagged by both SeaTools AND Disks under Ubuntu. If they were, I missed them. But, TrueNAS isued a Critical Alert indicating 5 Unrecoverable Sectors for one drive, and the other reported a Failed Extended S.M.A.R.T. test (sent back RMA w/o recording the details on THAT HDD…).
Is it silly to wonder why HDD testing using SeaTools and Ubuntu’s Disks utility did not flag these problems and why TrueNAS did? I WAS relying of the GUIs for the Ubuntu testing, so might have seen more had I used the command line. But, it was the TrueNAS GUI that drove me to the command line tools in TrueNAS.
Personally until drives pass a full series of badblocks tests where every single bit of the entire drive is written, read, and confirmed + long smart tests, I don’t even consider it a usable drive. Yey for 5+ days of burn-in & testing…
I’ve never had any trust with any kind of vendor tests because they just seem to me like a bloated GUI overlayed on top of SMART; only useful for updating firmware at best. Can’t talk about Ubuntu test because I’ve never used it, but if I had to guess it likely just uses SMART & maybe has a few other minor features? Someone will correct me.
If I HAD to guess, none of the tests you performed actually wrote to each and every single possible sector of the drive, hence until information failed to write/read from a bad sector, there would be no failed smart test, hence neither test showed any issues. Truenas came in, attempted to write/read to sectors that were crap, flagged them, and you got your warning that drives were crap.
You mentioned a drive outright failed a smart test (guessing before data was written) - likely that was a long vs (I’m assuming) short test that the previous tests ran?
Actually, TN didnt do any extended testing, and seems to have reported directly (and immediately) from S.M.A.R.T. data. It was SeaTools and Ubuntu Disks that each did something for nearly 24°/HDD. SeaTools ran those tests concurrently. Ubuntu would only let one be run after the prior test completed. So, it took several DAYS to cycle through all four HDDs.Can’t say what exactly those extended tests were doing, though I’d hoped for a thorough R/W go-over of the entire disk. So, yeah, I was trying to reassure myself about the integrity of these HDDs w/o destroying them in the process, LOL. They did get warm, but not hot.
Thanks. I’ll take a look. Irony is, I’ve been using and building computers for 40+ years, and recall only a single HDD failure during that entire interval, going back to when 100Mb was considered a large drive! Now, some would have failed had they not been replaced w larger ones. To have 2/4 fail is possibly par for used/“re-furbished” drives that have seen 3-5 years of prior service. The only time I ever previously installed used drives was in putting together an NCR Microchannel machine from a box of parts which included some SCSI drives. But, the vendor for these drives has been completely cooperative w issuing RMAs. I hope it’s not because they have a lot of practice!
I’ve been buying drives from goharddrive.com for years w/o issues. When I have had to return something, the vendor shipped out replacements ASAP or refunded.
Unlike the OEMs, the vendor is willing to sell you a real 5-year warranty. Not pro-rated, no requirement to run Seatools or some other proprietary package, just straight-up bad SMART = replacement.
@jgreco didn’t have a positive experience with the OEM so I may have just gotten lucky.
Just know, refurbished drives are almost always just used drives that they did validation testing on. That vendor does this and re-writes SMART values to appear as a new(er) drive.
I also often look on eBay for bulk “LOTS” and often time get really good deals. You can treat used hard drives as “I should buy 2” for each that you need. Hot spares.
At $79 a pop for an He10 drive, I’d be crazy not to pounce, qualify, and enjoy the insurance. There was a time when you could shuck them but WD no longer packages He drives in their consumer external gear so used it is.
That’s not universally true for all drive sizes, /r/datahoarder is the source of truth, I’m sure you’ll find more info there. I
can confirm tho I have a couple of non-helium 10 TiB drives that I received in disappointment. These were “True” Western Digital drives, not HGST tech, when previously you were getting rebadged HGST drives. However, they have like 3 or 4 years on them now and never had a problem
I mostly do it for the lower wattage associated with Helium-filled drives. Less power = less heat = happier NAS. AFAIK, WD no longer makes He-filled drives in the 10TB capacity range - those enclosures are likely reserved for the high-end, high-capacity drives. But NOS He10 series drives are about 3x or more of the used drives.
It was SeaTools and Ubuntu Disks that each did something for nearly 24°/HDD.
Huh, now that is surprising & unexpected. Now I’m wondering if it is how hardware is setup instead… you’re not using a port multiplier for TrueNas right?
It could again be that the previous tests were only doing reads of the entire drives, vs Truenas trying to write something & immediately hitting a bad block & reporting failure. Or it could be hardware related… or I guess you really got them 99.9% of the way to failure before connecting them to TN
My HGST drives did come from GoHardDrives via Newegg, @ $69 each. And they didnt monkey w the S.M.A.R.T. data (I’d heard that was not possible…). Mine showed significant prior use (3 - 5 years) and, of course, 2/4 show actual S.M.A.R.T. problems. As painless as they’ve made the RMA process, it’s still a nuisance to replace 2/4 drives right out of the gate. But, a real 5-year warranty is worth the cost of the drive itself, especially w their no hassle approach. And, they knew these drives would NOT power-on w 3.3V on pin-3, so provided the necessary 4-wire SATA adapter to by-pass that matter. Until I actually READ the included WD printout explaining, I was pulling my hair out. Drives were first tested in my W11 PC which did NOT have a 3.3V SATA lead. I could not figure out (until I read the fine manual) why they didn’t show on my NAS box. Ive since removed that 3.3V wire so don’t need the adapters, which removed nearly four (4) feet of unnecessary cabling. Much tidier. But GoHardDrives provided the description and a work-around to the matter. I’m OK w GoHardDrives…
